A guest post by fellow former regional press officer Janice Small who is helping 
organise Kent Conservatives’ EU trealy rallies.
This post focuses on a subject close to our hearts – our decaying health service for our elderly to ensure they have dignity at all times, and are allowed the care and medication they need without having to swing through hoops – or being denied it.
As we all become more mobile and lead busier lives, one growing sector of the population, the elderly, have become a forgotten and uncared for burden on society. I’d like to use this platform, kindly offered by Ellie, to highlight some of the policies put forward by the Conservatives and ask you to support two campaigns that campaign for the elderly.
The Conservatives, are prepared to put our money where our mouth is, and are recommending that we nearly DOUBLE Carers Allowances. In addition we aim to allow carers to keep more of their income without losing their entitlement to the Carers Allowance.
Carers UK, the organisation that represents carers across the country warmly welcomed the recommendations made by the Conservative Party’s Social Justice Policy Group on valuing the role of carers and raising the level of financial support carers receive.
Key Facts on Carers under Labour
· If carers earn over £87 per week the benefit is completely withdrawn.
· Those caring for under 35 hours a week are not entitled to Carers Allowance.
· Carers are very understandably angry about the current derisory amount of Carers Allowance.
· It does not reflect either the contribution they make or the hidden costs associated with disability.
· The rules make it very difficult for carers to build up a decent pension to support themselves and their loved-ones in retirement.
Unfortunately in the world’s fifth largest economy there are still a million pensioners living in poverty, they have suffered above inflation council tax rises and some face an inflation rate of 9 per cent, more than three times the official rate. Added to this the cost of fuel has rocketed with gas bills rising by 71 per cent and electricity by 45 per cent, despite falling wholesale prices. These costs are unbearable for many who are on fixed incomes.
I urge you to support the following:
- Support Age Concern’s Hungry to be Heard campaign to highlight the scandal of malnourishment amongst older people in hospital.
- Support for the British Geriatrics Society campaign – Behind Closed Doors – on the right to use the toilet in privacy.
- The system for claiming should be simplified starting with automatic payment of Council Tax Benefit – only claimed by 60% of those entitled. Lobby your MPs and councillors to change this ridiculous bureaucracy.
- 2.1m do not claim pensions credit – this should be an automatic payment. Lobby your MPs, the vulnerable should not have to jump through hoops to get what is rightfully theirs.
Pensioners should be treated with respect, have easy access to transport and information on local amenities together with feeling safe and secure. We’re all going to get there one day.
It is time for a change in how we look after those, who are looking after others.
Are you sure about your figure of 60%? Are you using Government figures to reach this conclusion? We can pretty well prove that the take up is closer to 98%.
http://www.isitfair.co.uk/downloads/iif%20Tax-Ben.doc
01428 712680
While you are on about supporting something then please support our online petition
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/uk-carers-are-seeking-a-realistic-income-for-carers
Carers know the ‘ideas tree’ (as well as being extremely patronising) is a typical Labour PR exercise where Carers leave an idea and Labour ignores it, we might be Carers, overworked/underpaid and knackered BUT we ain’t stupid!
And if you will excuse the ‘rant’ WHY are Carers excluded from governmental consultations that are supposed to include us? The Standing Commission for example, UK Carers although being the busiest online support group for Carers has yet to be invited to this commission, we were excluded from the DCS forum in favour of well-paid charity employees so WHEN CAN WE EXPECT TO BE ALLOWED TO PUT ACTUAL CARERS POINTS OF VIEW? NO charity worker knows the realities of being a Carer but time and time again Carers UK are asked to provide input (probably because it’s a government lapdog, try looking at their finances to see who is the major financial contributor)
If anyone wants to help Carers then that is great BUT they need to talk to actual Carers and to do that you need to look up http://www.ukcarers.org.uk though don’t expect the stereotypical Carer in there, we are different/unique, with us you see the real side of Carer’s, the tired and frustrated impatient Carers that say what they think.
Christina:
Take-up of Council Tax Benefit is lowest amongst pensioners. The percentage of pensioners claiming the Council Tax Benefit for which they are entitled, according to Department for Work Pension statistics, has fallen by 10% from 1998/99.
See the annual Income Related Benefits Estimates of Take-Up the latest edition:
http://www.dwp.gov.uk/mediacentre/pressreleases/2004/feb/nspr-260204.pdf
· In May 1998 5.4 Million people claimed Council Tax Benefit. By May 2003, the last date from which figures are available, this had declined to 4.6 million (ONS Work and Pensions Statistics 2003 p152). This is despite large real terms increases to Council Tax Bills leaving more people eligible for Council Tax Benefit.
http://www.dwp.gov.uk/asd/asd1/workandpens/2003/WPS_2003.pdf
I welcome any initiative that would help carers, who are generally forgotten and even penalised by an unfair system for what they do.
Carers are treated appallingly. To withdraw benefit in certain cirmstances is disgraceful.
I hope this is successful, since carers seem to be badly treated.
I had always thought the system was better there than anywhere else, but obviously it has changed over the years.
The ‘system’ has always exploited Carers jmb, it’s just since UK Carers started up that Carers have become bolshy and noisy, it’s proof that what we are doing and saying isn’t liked by the ‘establishment’ when the main Carer charity tries to sabotage our web site!!
Nothing will change until Carers are allowed to speak for themselves but they are actively blocked from doing that by Carers UK which is understandable, lets face it, if Carers were OK there would be no need for this inept charity (40 years in existence in one form or another and Carers are still being screwed over by the government…oh, did I say that the biggest donation/source of funding for this charity is from the government?)
It’s time the media spoke to us (Carers) and not to a charity CEO who draws a whopping £60+ thousand a year in salary, we await with baited breath
Have huge sympathy with the carers and agree that more should be done. But I am a little concerned at party politicisation of this by Tory supporters or employees. However raw a deal there is now is it not better than in 1997 by a good deal more than RPI increases?
I could be wrong, I’m guessing, information on the history either way would be very welcome.
Chris Paul, things haven’t got better, they have stayed pretty pathetic, you would need to be a Carer to appreciate this fact.
Some people have benefited hugely from Carers, notably Imelda Redmond CEO of Carers UK who now draws a salary of over £60.000 a year with a stonking good pension plan, contrast that with Carers who retire and have their Carers Allowance stolen/taken away, most Carer charity employees do well in comparison so some people are doing well, as usual it isn’t Carers though, some Carers are in such dire straights they have committed suicide because THAT is how desperate some Carers are, most can look forward to their caring role ending only when THEY die or the person THEY CARE FOR dies, doesn’t sound like things are getting better does it?
Oh, and it’s NOT because of Tory voters, all 3 main political parties are REFUSING to help Carers because of the estimated 60 BILLION POUNDS A YEARS they save the UK, no party will commit to helping relieve Carer-poverty, you will hear about New Deal for Carers and the latest Standing Commission for Carers but the reality of those sorts of consultations are that Carers are BLOCKED from giving input in favour or some well-paid charity employee with NO IDEA what being a full-time Carer entails, either that or they ‘hand pick’ members of their charity that will say what the charity WANTS them to say (and they are then rewarded by being made a trustee)
Carers are DESPERATE to be heard, DESPERATE to let the public know what they are going through, the media don’t class them as newsworthy enough though unless you would care to prove them wrong Ellee? We have members of UK Carers that are dying to be heard why not use us? You won’t get the stereotypical simpering Carer that is constantly shown. We just need someone with the courage to use us
Carers have to work 35 hours MINIMUM to receive just over £48 whereas some layabout who has no intention of getting a job can sit at home watching TV and receive more. Carers allowance should be increased by up to 300% and the overlapping benefit rule for the allowance scrapped. This country would rather allow immigrants in that are only coming for the benefits and health service stop them and the country will have extra money. One thing I always find strange is that whenever the politicians want to give themselves extra money it is available, or to offer aid to another country in the form of money, there is never any for carers and the government doesn’t see what carers do as a job if it isn’t then millions of carers could be available for work let’s see them explain a large increase in those available for work
Just to say that Clive and UK carers does not represent carers. They are a ragtag group of a few individuals. CLive in no way represents anyone but himself. Those that disagree with him recieve hate mail of the most vicious kind and he has be reported for harressment and warned by the police several times
Ahh David, yet another attempt to smear me, I must be doing something to worry people if they have to lie about me.
I only contact people that ask me for my help, I have never been in trouble with the police in my life except for doing 34 MPH in a 30 zone trying to get my wife who was starting to go into an epileptic seizure somewhere safe to park and deal with the fit though I did have one other ticket about 10 or 5 years ago.
Are you the same person going around posting lies but using different names AND even my own name to post I wonder?
I quite like being called someone that represents a rag-tag group, being the underdog suits me, it always has done, the thing is I have never had to lie about someone, I find the truth is so much more damaging. As for UK Carers? I’ll let teh stats talk for themselves, we are the most popular and the most representative group of Carers on the internet.
For the record if ANYONE wants to look into my ‘so called’ police record (not that they will find one) then please do, I’m ashamed to say it’s quite boring.
David says:
September 17th, 2007 at 11:14 pm
Just to say that Clive and UK carers does not represent carers. They are a ragtag group of a few individuals. CLive in no way represents anyone but himself. Those that disagree with him recieve hate mail of the most vicious kind and he has be reported for harressment and warned by the police several times
You know this because? I am dying to hear the facts of how you seem to know this or are you full of bull,David (surname wouldn’t be Platt would it).
You should get a life then again maybe not. maybe you could follow the advice of this number plate P155 0FF
Just to say that Clive and UK carers does not represent carers. They are a ragtag group of a few individuals. CLive in no way represents anyone but himself. Those that disagree with him recieve hate mail of the most vicious kind and he has be reported for harressment and warned by the police several times
So we are not real carers David then please tell us what the hell we are doing living in poverty and looking after at least 1 disabled person, seeing as I belong to ukcarers will you please send me a copy of this police report that you shoot your mouth of about, personally I hope Clive prosecutes you for spreading lies, it is prats like you that give carers a bad name.
I am glad that my blog engendered debate but a shame it has dipped to personal remarks.
Yes, the Conservative Party is trying to redress the balance of the burden placed on carers by recognising that we have a rapidly ageing population. I question why some seek to criticise us for highlighting the problems and offering solutions. We will double the carers allowance but this is not enough. What about children who are carers? These kids slip through the net, do not get paid for caring and receive little support because of overstretched social services. I have heard harrowing stories of children who support parents who are disabled, alcoholics, drug users and terminally ill. Society has to look outwards rather than inwards and think about what I can do for society rather than what it can do for me. Part of this would be giving a few hours to the your local Volunteer Bureau or other local charity who help others – it may be shopping for an elderly relative, tidying a disabled person’s garden, helping disadvantaged children to read … the list is endless.
Ok Janice what you are saying, is the conserative party will double carers, which is a good start, but without removing the overlapping rule as well it will make a lot of carers worse off, this is why we say real carers must be involved in all these debates, otherwise you are going to end up with a teir system where some carers are well off and others are living below poverty, and that is not fair, no matter what the illness or the the person you care for it incurrs added expenditure to you budget, you mention the rise in gas and electric price increase a disabled person spends at least double the time a able bodied person you have to keep them warm, I think as carers we do a lot for society we can not fit much more in.
Janice say it is a shame her blog has dipped into personal remarks and I totally agree with her, but the reason it does is because a small group of people are so anti clive, without foundation, that any comment he makes anywhere brings a smear campaign onto him and his board, UKCarers. As this is the only open board, I suggest that anyone who reads the remarks about it has a look and sees for themselves. They will not find a “ragtag” collection of people, but real, genuine carers with real, genuine concerns, helped by each other, with a wealth of information gathered at the hard end.
The fabric of society has changed much in the last years, and not for the better. People are afraid to offer help and those who need it are often afraid to ask, especially in areas where english is not the common language or where gangs run riot as their parents have no way of, or inclination,of stopping them. Then there are the other areas where everybody works, just to be able to afford to live and you don’t see a soul all day.
Carers of all ages, go unnoticed because there is no-one with the time to notice them, except other carers.
And this can all be traced back to Government initiatives.
Government needs to re find the values we have lost to bring a caring society back into being.
Lifting carers out of poverty and removing overlapping rules which make benefits not worth the paper they are printed on would be a good start.
It is time to put our own house in order, before paying out millions in benefits to people who have never lived in this country, let alone contributed to our economy.
Janice, I’ve been getting these sorts of accusations thrown at me since I started UK Carers and it’s great to know some people see me and UK Carers as such a threat that they need to lie about my character, as I said there is no truth in what David said, in fact I rarely email people unless they make first contact in case someone tries this sort of tactic, I’m many things but stupid and naive? Nuh-uh.
IF you are really intending to better things for Carers then start asking why ‘actual’ Carers are blocked from government consultation processes in favour of people that have no real idea of what we go through, I’d love to know the answer to this (though most Carers have a good idea)
I mentioned something regarding child Carers a while ago, something like money paid into a trust fund payable when they leave school, these kids work so should be able to benefit from what they do at some stage, if a kid gets paid money for choosing to do a paper round then a kid that is forced into taking up a caring role should be paid, simplistic example but a valid one.
Identifying Carers, here’s an idea I was going to put to Barbara Keeley till her office worker wrongly replied to my email (with a sarcastic and insulting comment regarding Carers and was followed up with a panicky phone call from Ms Keeley trying to distance herself from the comment, even hiding behind Ministerial privilege’s when asked under the Freedom Of Information Act to supply emails John Farrell had forwarded to her) My idea, with every yearly DLA upgrading notification the DWP place a slip informing the DLA recipient that anyone supplying 35 hours care provision is entitled to Carers Allowance and they should apply or get advice on applying, simple, cost effective, doesn’t need hoards of staff manning the phones, no expensive ad campaigns needed, but that’s too obvious isn’t it?
As others have said, raising Carers Allowance WITHOUT removing the overlapping rule which actually penalises people for being a Carer will only make matters worse, scrap it tomorrow and you would have a load of pensioners better off for a start, think of the positive publicity any party would get.
Long and short or things is, and I know that politicians and well paid charity workers will DISAGREE, that you are forced into becoming a Carer, there is NO CHOICE unlike fostering which begs another question, if foster carers receive a ‘minimum income guarantee’ for something they CHOOSE to do then why aren’t CARERS allowed a guaranteed minimum income?
We, UK Carers, have constantly asked MP’s to face us and explain WHY we are exploited and none have taken that challenge, we have challenged MP’s to ‘live the life of a Carer’ but who in their right mind would volunteer to live on under 50 quid a week?
6 million Carers are getting screwed over, what you are proposing won’t change things, neither will the Standing Commission or the patronising Ideas Tree, we are an economical bonus to the UK but we are described as ‘
“economically inactive” in other words work-shy scroungers, any idea how that feels?
Janice to understand Carers you have to speak TO them, not DOWN to them, then again Carers are rarely spoken to at all so why not take part in our message board, we are waiting for someone with balls to step into teh lions den and tell us (Carers) why we are constantly treated like something you trod in
Our carers online forum have started the following e-petition to ask for an allowance for pensioners to eat healthy food.
If the government can afford to do this for pregnant women why not pensioners, after all there’s a choice involved with pregnancy, not with getting old.
The link is
http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/freshfruitveg/
Thanks
Paula – National Carers Forum
http://tonyrhodes.f.xaviermedia.com/
We do not need a petition for healthy meal allowance for pensioners. How many of them would want to fill in yet another round of incomprehensible forms, all in the likeley hood they would be turned down. Pensioners and disabled and carers need a decent income, not a bigger begging bowl.
I am glad that you do not need such an allowance pansy, it is a shame that in this day and age lots of pensioners are suffering from malnutrition not just in their own homes, but in our NHS hospitals, this allowance would be paid to all pensioners at the age of retirement, no form filling would be required,i agree that pensioners and carers and the disabled need decent incomes, that to me is an obvious statement, surely you would not begrudge pensioners recieving this extra allowance? Pensioners are going without all the time, just as carers and disabled people are,the allowance if i am correct is an extra, to me that sounds a good idea, if the government does it for pregnany woman then it can do it for our pensioners.
I think you misunderstood. I do not begrudge pensioners any extras at all. I just think they ought to receive a pension, that they have worked all their lives for, to be able to afford the extras, without having them doled out as an extra. And before there is any more misunderstanding, I do not think that healthy food is an extra, but a basic neccesity of life. The fact that some pensioners cannot afford more than subsistence living is a terrible indictment on our society.
Therefore the petition should be for a decent pension, not another hand out. Who wants, at the end of their working life, after supporting yourself and your family, to be reliant on hand outs?
No one wants to have to rely on hand outs but sadly that is why we have so many campaigning groups and charities in this country because there is a need, i also agree that pensioners should have a decent pension but untill that miracle happens it should not stop anyone from trying to get something extra for those less fortunate.
Hand out, or whatever you like to call it wont do any harm will it?
Pensioners/carers/disabled people all deserve to have enough money to be able to live on without the worry of saying can i put the heating on, can i afford to have a hot meal, can i afford a winter coat,all i am trying to do is to achieve something for a group of society that i think is treated poorly, thats all, if you want to support it you will, if you dont you wont, i hope you will.
So you are advocating a universal allowance payable to any pensioner regardless of how much money they have? Doesn’t that sound odd? So a millionaire pensioner gets this hand out too? Sorry but that needs rethinking.
Also the response to pansy needs an apology, pansy said “Pensioners and disabled and carers need a decent income” so jumping down her throat without reading the post in it’s proper context makes your argument/reply look petty and spiteful and petty and does your cause NO GOOD whatsoever.
One of the reasons pensioners don’t claim some benefits they are entitled to is because of having to fill in benefit forms so you will either have a universal benefit where rich pensioners get even more money or a means tested one where many pensioners won’t apply for it because of form filling as pansy so rightfully said.
AND ANOTHER THING, the number 10 site is a joke, a PR exercise where NO petition is taken seriously by this government, it won’t even get past the web team let alone to the PM so I won’t be supporting any other petition on the government site and I hope others won’t either, it’s a waste of their time and effort.
You really need to inject some realism your thinking Tony instead of thinking everyone is against you or bullying you, you are offered advice or told what will happen and you shut yourself off, you cannot be a National Forum when anyone that disagrees with you is banned and the public in general is shut out, it’s like other places that shut themselves of from the public, you just start to look sly, devious and suspicious. Can’t have it both ways.
Well I have to go for tonight, the police are knocking at my door to cart me away because I’m such a hardened criminal LOLOL!!!
Good Morning Clive.
Well, as you obviously disagree with the petition, I guess this idea is one you can’t say Tony has ‘stolen’ from you, that is a relief!
I would suggest you pop down to Specsaver today and then take another look at Tony’s comments, nowhere did he ‘jump down Pansy’s throat’ as you put it, they were having a cilvilised discussion but of course you wouldn’t like that would you, that way you couldn’t take the comments back to your own site and ‘extract the urine’ out of us could you?
The reason we have changed the site so you have to register to view the threads is very simple, we have people on there who don’t really want their views copied and pasted onto your ‘forum’ and then ripped to shreds just because they don’t agree with you, we respect our members and no one has been banned for disagreeing with any of us – we leave that sort of thing to you.
Have a nice day
Paula
Morning clive, with regard to me thinking everyone is against me, i dont think that at all, what annoys me is that anything said or suggested by myself or others is shouted down, i have no problem with people not liking my ideas or thoughts but you and some of your friends make it a personal thing.
If you dont agree with other peoples campaigning ideas thats fine too, just let those people go their way and you campaign in yours, your ideas and methods are fine for you but dont attack others who want to go other ways.
I have not banned anyone from my message board, my board is closed partly for the reason paula has pointed out and the other is because i want my members to have a place to go to where they feel safe and secure, most people i know are fed up with all this personal attack that seems to be going on, if you want to attack me and that makes you feel better clive, then go ahead, i want to concentrate on what i do, why dont you do the same, you have made it quite clear on your views regarding other carers groups etc, you dont want unity, you have said that, you have a particular mindset, your like a tree that will not bend in the wind, eventually the branches will snap and break off, you are a clever man, and again i say you should focus your anger towards the correct place and people, dont attack people who are in the same boat as you, focus your energy at the government clive, i suppose i will get attacked again for this piece of writing, oh well.
I dont think i have anything to say sorry to Pansy for, i did not jump down her throat or attack her, i leave those things to other people.
I hope you are well clive, have a nice day and i mean that.
Tony Rhodes
I received an email from a carer, this sums up the issues:
I was a 24/7 carer till my mam died last year.I still help care for my brother,40
yrs old,who is severely disabled since birth and we have an excellent care package
in place for him that enables me to work part-time.A busmans holiday so to speak,I
am a personal assistant ( paid carer ) to an elderly couple 16 hours per week.Both
lady and gentleman have ill health and yet only recently I helped their family in a
battle to ensure their services were not cut as Soc Services wanted to do.For
example they wanted me to go in to their house and feed both of them in 15 mins
lunchtime and 15 mins teatime.Do they truly expect this elderly couple to live on
sandwiches the rest of their life.They even wanted to withdraw time allocated for
shopping.How were they supposed to eat and what were they to eat if no food in.
Just let people go their way without telling them they are wasting their time? That’s very constructive I don’t think, the time they waste could be put to better use but you don’t see that do you?
You should be concentrating your efforts on getting the latest Standing Commission for Carers to actually INCLUDE Carers, not EXCLUDE them, if that’s beyond your limits then you are just small-fry, again that’s not a criticism just an observation.
As for the suggestion that I ban people on our board I think you need to look at the accuracy of that statement, one person was banned for spreading lies about me personally though the person that continually tries to say I have a criminal record must feel very threatened by me and UK Carers to keep trying that (wonder if it’s a mod from Carers UK? They have failed in their attempt to drive our bandwidth OTT after all) Though you have indulged in a little ‘banning’ ya little fibber you.
I want Carers to get what Carers ask for, I’d rather not ‘bend’ on that and if YOU would then you have no rights claiming to be fighting for Carers.
Yes I see other Carers groups as sparsely populated inane groups doing the same mundane ‘hello’s/good-nights’ and sucking up to the main charities doing petitions on number 10’s site which will amount to nothing, everyone congratulating themselves on nothing in particular and diluting what had gone before it because “safe and secure” seems ‘best’ when in reality “safe and secure” is what has buggered Carers for years but it’s OK because it’s ‘safe’ It’s what political parties love about Carers, they’ll accept crumbs after a little whinging and you are making their jobs easier for it.
As I said, there can be no ‘united carers’ coalition, union or whatever you care to name it because something like that will be manned by people willing to accept whatever little is doled out to them and that ain’t good enough in my eyes.
PaulaH, please read what you wrote then realise what you said is what you accuse me of, the only difference is that I don’t mind if you want to rip what I say to bits but at least be honest what you post about me, it’s called maturity and you have big enough and have the ability to take comments if people think they are wrong.
If you don’t want other people to comment on what you write then you don’t post it in an online message board, that’s the internet for you, you have to accept what will happen to what you post.
As I said you cannot call yourself a ‘national’ ANYTHING and then go hide away, it could be classed/seen as an ‘irrational-national’
Good quote Tony and PaulaH “there are none as blind as those that will not see”
As I have said, UK Carers are the only ones out to face down MP’s and chase the media to highlight Carer related issues aggressively because your way (and don’t even get me started on the other lot wasting their time with Compass!) DON’T-WON’T WILL NEVER work.
BTW you may copy whatever I post as I fully understand and acknowledge what the internet is and how it works, you should see some of the places UK Carers stuff gets posted around the world
Oh Clive, it’s good to see you running true to form – try and deflect comments back onto others, now are you accusing me of sabbotaging your bandwith or was it MI5 – surely that’s as bad as someone saying you have a criminal record, tut tut – what’s the saying, people in glass houses……..
As for reading my previous comments, you’ve already admitted to banning members who spread ‘lies’ about you so nothing I’ve said about you is untrue is it?
As for the internet being open to all, that is fair enough but as you should know given your caring experience, sometimes opening up on a forum is a very difficult thing to do but in some cases the only way to get help, who are you to then take those comments and ridicule them behind that persons back, how low will you stoop to score points Clive?
Perhaps if you take a little time to actually read the email Janice has posted we can get back to the matter in hand which is caring for the elderly and vulnerable in society, something as carers – and before you accuse me of being a ‘fake’ carer, I’ve been a carer for almost 21 years now – are really concerned about, we’ll all be old at some point, at least we’ve got the opportunity to make changes in the system now before our time comes to be reliant on that system – wouldn’t that be better than all this point scoring rubbish?
Paula
Again clive you are wrong, i closed my blog if thats what you were reffering to because you and your friends were continually attacking me personally, if you or your friends had been saying anything constructive then that would be ok, but it did not stop there did it clive?
Your not the only person or board that contacts politicians or media, oh i thought you hated publicity clive, or was that a little fib you devil.
I will say this again and then move on, you waste your time slagging other carers and their efforts off, that just shows what a sincere and kind person you are, i understand about the internet clive, the diffrence between you and i clive is that i dont get my kicks out of putting down carers who are trying to do their bit, bitterness will eat you up, grow up and leave carers alone, get on with your own campaigning and then you may just get somewhere, your board or its members do not speak for carers, it may speak for your membership but not all carers, anyone that does not agree with your points of view are attacked, you know what i think of that clive, its safe for you to attack people this way, face to face and you are the same as most people like yourself, frightened little lambs.
Have a nice day clive, i wish you all the best.
Tony Rhodes
I for one have seen enough of this stupidity, I strongly suggest the next person that wishes to throw accusations actually produces facts to back them up with, or keeps there mouth firmly shut and we can all get back to what the real issue is, we know not everybody agrees on everything, and when advice is given I would read it go away and think about it and make your own mind up, not automatically attack the person giving it. The only way to get anywhere with carers issues is to have real carers involved, which is what Clive has been saying all along.
I attacked your blog? Good god man get a grip!! Nothing I posted attacked you, you seem to have a paranoid demeanour and see any remarks as attacking you, that doesn’t reflect well on you or your group.
No, I actually DO hate publicity as I have stated, it makes doing what I do all the more unsettling to me.
As for face-to-face? I’m afraid I’m the same opinionated person, I’m the middle child of 5 boys (one sister but you get my drift) so whatever I wanted I had to shout and fight to be heard above the others and I have carried that on in real life as anyone that knows me will tell you, I’m afraid I will have to disappoint you with your ‘view’ of me, a ‘little lamb’ is SOOOooooo OFF-BASE you wouldn’t believe it.
PaulaH, you still haven’t grasped things, Carers UK tried hogging our bandwidth, do we have that straight now? And I banned one member for lies, not members, it would help if you stuck to reality *sigh* Again another point, I ridicule people to their faces as I expect to be ridiculed to mine the difference being YOU CAN ridicule me, I encourage it in fact. Can’t find where I called you a fake Carer, you’ll need to clarify that statement. Oh, to change the system you need to register a protest, that ISN’T on a place that is run by the very people you are protesting about, that’s sound advice OR you have an odd view of the world.
I do not put Carers down for their attempts to change things, I put them down when they claim ideas as their own, I inform them if they are wasting their time, I help as a first point of contact with local authorities/MP’s/ social services/local media/service providers/information etc, and you do?
To grow up you need to be able to accept criticism (note thread for criticising me on our site, where the whole internet can see?) I am fully mature, I have seen close relatives die from cancer, I have seem people eaten away by diseases, I have been hospitalised after standing in the way of someone attacking my brother, I had my skull cracked open with a wheel brace and so much more so I count myself as ‘grown up.
I am prepared to put myself up to be shot at by whoever wants to have a pop, and believe me some of the emails I receive you would not like to have to read but that’s MY problem, I deal with it.
Honestly you 2 you need to grasp what the internet is about and use it to the best of your ability, not whine when people don’t agree with you, as I have stated, Carers message boards fade away after a year or two because people become fed up with nothing happening, our hits continue to rise and those hits include government and media IP’s, that’s something that has happened since day ONE.
I deal in reality NOT smears, if the truth is hard to take then that is your problem not mine.
By the bye, pensioners have a well established campaign group if you didn’t know, it’s called the Pensioner Parliament, they are fighting damn hard for pensioners, good group, I’m amazed you hadn’t heard of them, they ran a successful campaign when pensioners were awarded 75p pension increase a couple of years ago, something Gordon Brown fought against doing, now whatever happened to GOrdon Brown? Oh I orgot, you are posting petitions for him to see aren’t you?
I’m so sorry Clive, I obviously misread your comments, you’re saying a CUK Mod is the one spreading ‘lies’ about your criminal record, and of course that would be me would it, and as the other Tony has said, if you’ve got evidence of this then produce it or shut up…………
For a man who allegedly hates publicity you certainly hide it well – every forum, blog, whatever there you appear spouting the same old line about UK Carers being the only board that matters and how your ideas are so wonderful, ever heard the expression change the record Clive?
This was a decent, constructive discussion about elderly care and yet again you’ve hijacked it with your own agenda, that’s not helpful to genuine carers (the fake carer jibe was, if my memory serves me right, some wild accusation from your board when the old CUK forum was in existance, we were apparently all CUK employees paid to post as carers – or have you a selective memory?).
Do you honestly think you’ve improved the image of UK Carers by this latest rant – in the meantime I’m not wasting anymore of my time, effort or infact electricity on replying to your ramblings, if you want to chalk this up as a victory, go ahead – quite frankly Clive, I couldn’t give a damn.
Paula
Clive said:
Yes I see other Carers groups as sparsely populated inane groups doing the same mundane ‘hello’s/good-nights’ and sucking up to the main charities doing petitions on number 10’s site which will amount to nothing, everyone congratulating themselves on nothing in particular and diluting what had gone before it because “safe and secure� seems ‘best’ when in reality “safe and secure� is what has buggered Carers for years but it’s OK because it’s ’safe’ It’s what political parties love about Carers, they’ll accept crumbs after a little whinging and you are making their jobs easier for it.
As for other carers groups being sparsely populated that may be true clive, your ukcarers may have quite a large recorded membership but in all reality we all know that the majority of members on your site are silent and do not post, others on the other hand have smaller memberships but get far more done, help more individuals and dont attack others just because they wont go along with you.
You also say that others efforts will amount to nothing, please do tell us clive what you have achieved for carers with your efforts? maybe before you slag others efforts off you may take a look at your own achievements, we are all trying hard to get things changed, the diffrence is that unlike you clive, the majority dont like hurting the very people they are aiming to help, you dont care who you hurt on the way.
Tony Rhodes
You should give me a ring clive, you have my number, i gave it to you ages ago but i suppose you would rather attack me on line as you enjoy the attention you little devil.
Unfortunately this saboutage of useful articles happens so often. The discussion becomes entirely about Clive and UKCarers.
It’s exactly what he wants to happen.
And the coven is complete!
What have I done? I’ve enable YOU to gain knowledge to set up a message board, granted you take no advice but that’s the way of some people.
What have I done? A lot more than is posted because I gave my word not to disclose personal information, lets concentrate on someones letter, what was the outcome of that and who was correct in the summing up of what would happen? Another little thing you might have noticed is that Carers UK have had to up their game since we started UK Carers.
We have had members on TV, radio, in the press, and you have done?
Sorry Cheryl but it became about ‘me’ when some idiot claimed I had a police record, you wouldn’t want people to say you had a criminal record if that was the case…would you? I reserve the right to tell the truth when someone tries to smear my good name. Oh, and you just added to the continuation of it! If you ALSO take teh time to read my first post you will see/read/comprehend it was about Carers being excluded from consultations, being the more pro-active group then we UK Carers have a right to be part of any such consultation, or ain’t yer Compass working?
Tony, your inexperience at message board running is showing you up slightly, most/all message boards have just a few posters compared to their total membership, that’s how they run, unlike most I have blocked the search engine ‘bots’ so the hits you see are actual people and have been for quite a while.
If you see the reality of what you are doing as an attack then you are a lost cause as is the other lot *shrug* I don’t have time to make personal phone calls and I prefer to have things posted/written down’ then people like Dave up there don’t have the chance to say “he threatened me over the phone” Just a quirk of mine.
I think you should learn to use blogs/message boards/fora as they were meant to be used, if you all shut up then I won’t need to come back here, it’s taking up my time anyway BUT both combined CLOSED OFF groups aren’t a match or on the same level as UK Carers, sorry but that’s life, we don’t suck up to people because that never worked in the past.
You may now go on to drag this out even further, I’m easy either way
Increasing Carers Allowance to almost double its present rate is a good start – but carers need much more to be done.
Currently their existing rights are trampled on with impunity and they are all too often left unsupported as a result.
Too little money is going into social care, leaving social services unable to provide even the basics. Which is why so many carers are angry and frustrated, as you can see from the many posts on this site.
No it won’t help UNLESS the overlapping benefit rule is scrapped, it will take Carers above the level for Income Support so could create even MORE financial hardship, but then again we could all just say we aren’t going to be Carers anymore I suppose *shakes head in amazement*
So Charles, why was the thread about sabotaging UK Carers blocked from public view by Carers UK? I personally think it’s an admission of guilt by default don’t you? Hell even their ISP won’t supply basic records of their excessive bandwidth usage claiming it is protected by the DPA which is pretty lame as excuses go
Clive, the overlapping benefit rule also needs to be scrapped. It’s one thing I can agree with you on.
Your post seems to be like most of your others – seeking a flame war. I’ll give you a single response to your comments and that’s it. Further posts from me on this site will be purely on the issues the blog editor actually asked for. You visit plenty of other sites I use so you have plenty of opportunity, you are ingenious enough.
Shaking your head in amazement doesn’t alter the fact of a legal right to choose and if you can’t get your head around that I suggest you look it up. I gave the reference on the Carers UK site you obviously read, presumably so you can check we’re not talking about you. We don’t. We have more important things to do.
I cannot speak for Carers UK. I am on this site and others that I frequent as a carer only. Nothing else. The views and opinions I give are personal to me, in the same way as your views are your own.
The thread was moved, not blocked. It was about Carers UK, not UK Carers and moved to the members’ part of the site. As membership is free, nobody was blocked from seeing the thread and the original thread, although blocked from further comment on that part of the site, remained in public view.
Guilt for what? I don’t know anyone at Carers UK who would want to spend more than a few minutes on your site. As far as trying to sabotage UKCarers I think the evidence on this site is enough to show that you do it for yourself.
Now, a challenge: keep the discussion on this site to the issues about what carers really need. I tried and got sniped at by a fellow carer who professes to be campaigning for carers. So campaign. And target the government – you know, the people who have the power to make the changes you want. Not the people who have the same aims as you (albeit by using different methods).
Morning Janice,
Thank you for posting some of my comments (no 27 ) that I sent you and for replying to my email.
The situation for many elderly is close to breaking point.Benefit system is a minefield,services being cut and day centres closed on a daily basis.All this will fall back on the family carers. You only have to look at the Lambeth situation to see how changing eligibilty criteria is affecting many vulnerable people who need our help.I agree with you that communities themselves should do more but it is even the basic of home care that is being cutback.Cash strapped councils are balancing books ahead of individuals needs.
We need get back to some of the old values and ensure that our elderly (be they disabled or not ) are treat with respect and enable them to maintain their dignity.Some elderly these days do not live,they just exist, from one day to another.
For every ONE of us who is aware of what is going on,how many hundreds,thousands are sat at home now with no services,no heating,no money and no-one to battle in their corner for them.
This government ( past and future too ) have a duty to care for those most vulnerable,to provide a quality of life and to date, each one has FAILED that duty.
I used Lambeth as an example about eligibility criteria being tightened but it is happening country wide.Councils are changing qualifying criteria so that only those classed as critical needs are receiving help.In the few cases where they keep the substantial category,what happens??.I will tell you what is happening.Care services are then priced out of reach.They simply move the goalposts so to speak.
I look forward to reading more on this blog about something that at some point is going to affect us all.
Thank you
Rosemary
it’s all ‘Carer’related Charles and valid.
Why have the thread only for members to read? That’s VERY suspicious, you can see photographic (screen capture) evidence of this charities devious tactics so it’s not an attempt to cause problems, just to ‘out’ this charity for the tactics it uses, something frowned upon by people that use the internet BTW. Oh, those “few minutes” were in actual fact almost 24 hours non stop, from Carers UK’s static IP.
I contacted Anne McGuire saying I wanted to stop/resign from my caring role and how do I go about it, no chance was the short version of her reply, your ‘observation’ is flawed, there are no enforceable ‘laws’ allowing Carers to stop their caring role, being an educated person I would have thought you would have known that, on the whole you are locked into caring until you are psychically unable to care, you die or the person you care for dies (can’t remember, wasn’t it you that said someone caused their mother’s death?).
As I have said before, I will target ANYONE that is being counter-productive be they a charity that is more interested in securing it’s salaries ABOVE helping Carers, Carers that provide false statements (loads of those on teh charity site) and hamper Carers getting what they deserve, people that lie and….well anyone really the government are part of the problem as are Carers UK because as you well know the government are the biggest source of income for this charity, I’m quite well-balanced you see, a chip on either shoulder.
Short version, Carers UK have failed Carers of all ages since their inception, they are a tool the government loves, tell me ONE TIME that Carers UK have EVER blasted the government of the day, to get change Carers need something better than what was on offer before we started, WE don’t hide the truth (unlike Caresr UK)
From 24dash.com
Thousands of elderly people ‘face cuts in council
Hundreds of thousands of elderly people in England may face cuts in services within the next few years due to an expected slowdown in central funding for local government, the leader of the country’s councils warned today.
Sir Simon Milton, the chairman of the Local Government Association (LGA), wrote today to all councils, warning them to prepare for “frank discussions” with local taxpayers about what care services they can afford.
The funding settlement in next month’s Comprehensive Spending Review (CSR) is likely to present councils with a level of “austerity” that they have not experienced for more than a decade, he warned.
If Chancellor Alistair Darling delivers a settlement of 2% above inflation, local authorities may be able to cope without breaching the Government’s unofficial 5% cap on annual council tax hikes, he said. But a 0% real-terms increase in central funding would create “real difficulties” for town halls, putting pressure both on council tax and services.
Much of the Government’s spending plan for the next three years is already set in stone, but the figures for local councils and the NHS will not be revealed until the CSR.
The LGA is lobbying ministers to switch money thought to be earmarked for the NHS over to preventative services for the elderly provided by councils, which it argues will help the health service in the long term by keeping older people out of hospital.
In his letter, Sir Simon wrote: “It appears likely the coming years will see a period of austerity that councils will not have seen for more than a decade.
“The situation is quite stark. If the settlement is at the upper – 2% real-terms increase – end of expectations, then in theory councils could get quite close to a sustainable position provided they are prepared to put up council tax by close to the 5% per year unofficial ‘capping’ level.
“However, if the settlement is at the lower – 0% real-terms increase – end of expectations, then there will be real difficulties for councils.
“In the next three years alone, there will be more than 400,000 more older people, many of whom will require social care. Without additional funding, local government may potentially face a situation by as early as 2009 where it cannot afford to provide support to 370,000 people with lower levels of need.
“A poor funding settlement for local government will inevitably place pressure on both council tax and services. This is not a situation older people and their families expect or deserve.
“There is a strong and compelling argument for ministers to invest in preventative services, provided by councils, for older people in their homes. This would save the NHS money, and consequently provide better value for money for the taxpayer.”
Support for services such as care for the elderly through the government grant has increased by 14% in real terms since 1997/98, compared to a 90% leap in funding for the NHS over the same period, said Sir Simon.
He cautioned councils to prepare for an “honest and mature debate” with the public about the level of service they are able to provide to older people.
“As councils, we have a duty to local residents to explain what the implications of the Government slowdown in investment will mean for residents,” he said.
“Funding settlements are always a difficult balancing act, and there are many pressures facing both central and local government.
“If the settlement is at the lower end of expectations, it is likely to result in tighter criteria for free or subsidised elderly care services, cuts in services or both.”
Local Government Minister John Healey said the Government had increased local authority funding by 39% over the past decade and that the LGA should not try to “second guess” the outcome of the spending review.
At the same time, he stressed that councils had a responsibility to budget “prudently” and he warned that the Government was prepared to step in to block “excessive” council tax increases.
“I am confident that local authorities can strike the right balance between improving services and protecting the taxpayer,” he said.
“There is also scope for significant efficiency savings which we and the local taxpayer expect to see. For our part, we are helping authorities by reducing red tape and giving them more financial flexibility.
“However, we do have capping powers and are prepared to use them in order to protect the council taxpayer from excessive increases if necessary.”
Is this the way of the future? Supply the meals once a fortnight and then forget about the elderly……………where is the CARE.How many elderly will receive said meals but not heat them up.Come winter who going to check on them.
**************************
Elderly to get frozen meal packs instead of hot meals service
HOT meals-on-wheels are being cut in favour of frozen dinners because the “traditional British meal is outdated”, Islington Council has decided.
Hundreds of vulnerable and elderly people who get a hot lunch every day will soon get a pack of frozen meals dropped off once a fortnight.
At the moment, 288 people get meals on wheels, with 209 getting a hot meal every day.
But the council’s Liberal Democrat executive decided last Thursday to award the meals contract to a new company.
The number of hot lunches delivered will be scaled down.
But there will be more choice because, the council report stated, “the notion of a ‘traditional’ British meal is outdated”.
People are currently offered meals based on their background or dietary requirements.
In the future, they will be able to choose dinners from the full range, which includes cottage pie, chicken tikka masala and spicy fried chicken.
But Lizzie McLennan, of charity Help the Aged, said: “If they asked older people whether they would prefer choice or someone visiting them, they would prefer the visit.”
Retired post officer driver Ted Williams, 80, of Brecknock Road, Holloway, said: “Having somebody at the door gives you a bit of comfort.”
Labour councillor and former Mayor of Islington Joan Coupland said: “Many older people rely on a visit from the service. But all they are going to get is a freezer of TV dinners.”
Bill Bayliss, 91, former Islington branch secretary of The Royal British Legion, who already has frozen dinners delivered every fortnight, said: “I have a traditional British meal and it’s very good. I can’t see what the problem is.”
John Gilbert, the Lib-Dem councillor for adult social services, added: “Islington will still give hot meals in the home for those who need them.
“To people who can manage a microwave, we will give a choice of good quality frozen meals.
This is so sad Rosemary, I remember doing a volunteer stunt on ‘meals on wheels’ when I was at secondary school (MANY years ago!) and it was a great experience.
A lot of the pensioners literally never spoke to another person apart from the meals on wheels delivery driver, they were so grateful and chatty – it took us ages to do the rounds!
Paula
Its not only sad Paula but frightening.I have read it several times and each time it scares me more.
You and I, along with many others, are aware of what is going on.The internet and various carer forums bring the events to our door every single day.
What future is there for some of our elderly?
It has been said many a time that the circumstances regarding the elderly/disabled/carers is not much of a topic for newspapers to cover.
There should be a national outcry by ALL press/media.We have so many commissions set up by this government.I would like to see a group set up of a selection of journalists including ones who do not agree that there is a problem.Let them investigate,let them report the atrocities faced by some people and let them bring this national disgrace out in to the open.
Carers as we know have so little resources and time, yet daily we try highlight the situations and make others aware of what is going on.
The battle continues Paula………just how many casualities is this winter going to bring………………………..
Rosemary
x x x
Until society’s attitude towards the elderly changes Rosemary, things will sadly get worse.
I know people think this is a myth but I can remember my Mum checking up on elderly neighbours in winter, in those days if anyone hadn’t taken their milk in then a neighbour would go round and see if they were OK. We can go weeks without seeing our neighbours, I dread to think what would happen if Mum lived on her own.
Can you imagine the media uproar if an animal was left on it’s own for 2 weeks even with food, the RSPCA would be banging the door down yet it’s acceptable to do the same for an elderly person.
I fear this will be a harsh winter for a lot of elderly people, not only because of the weather.
Paula xx
Carers save UK £87 billion per year
20 September 2007
New report shows 52 per cent increase in value of unpaid care – more than total annual spend on NHS
The value of unpaid support that carers provide has now reached £87 billion a year according to a new report (1) by Carers UK – more than the annual total spend on the NHS, which stood at £82 billion in the year 2006-7.
The new figures, calculated by the University of Leeds for Carers UK – the leading charity for people caring for their sick, disabled or frail relatives and partners, are 52 per cent higher than previous estimates of how much carers save the UK (2) – £57 billion in 2002 – and the average carer is saving the nation over £15,260 a year.
The new figures are also more than four times the amount spent on social care services for adults and children by local authorities each year – £19.3 billion in the year 2005-2006.
The dramatic rise in the value of carers’ support is a warning to policy makers about the extent to which our economy relies on the care provided by family and friends. It shows that if only a small number were to give up caring – perhaps through ill health or lack of support – the economic impact could be disastrous. Given our demographics and ageing population, it shows the urgent need for better recognition and support for carers.
Many carers remain isolated and unsupported, with thousands living in poverty and unable to take up paid work or have a normal social life. On the eve of Gordon Brown’s first Labour Party Conference as Prime Minister, Carers UK wants Government to recognise the huge contribution made by carers.
Imelda Redmond, Chief Executive of Carers UK says, “When you put a monetary value on carers’ contribution to the economy, it shows the stark reality of the true costs. It is clear that without carers, our NHS and social care systems would collapse. Indeed their input is so vast that it has kept pace with the extra investment put by Government into the NHS.
“It is ironic, given the billions they contribute to the economy, that so many carers are forced into poverty and a low quality of life. We need concerted action from Government, employers and public bodies to end social exclusion among carers. Carers are invaluable to the UK – it is time they were given the support and recognition to become valued and equal members of society.
“When we look at the wider economic impact, support to carers becomes even more significant. Every year, one in five carers gives up work to care. By 2034, an extra 3.4 million people could be caring, at a time when the economy needs more skilled workers. The contribution carers make is gradually being recognised in law and in government policies, but in the light of these figures today, developing and funding this support needs to be a urgent priority for all.�
The rise in the value of carers’ support can be put down to three factors:
The number of carers providing “significant� care has risen, owing to health and social care failing to keep pace with demand.
Although more hours of care are being provided in the community it is being provided to fewer people because they have increasingly complex needs. This leaves carers making up much of the shortfall.
The cost of replacement care has gone up, in line with other wages.
Key recommendations in the report include:
Robust economic costing to determine the risk to the economy if insufficient care is provided in the future.
Significant investment in social care, including stimulation of the care market.
New legislation to make it illegal to discriminate against carers – in the same way that it is for disabled people.
A full scale review of carers’ benefits; and the exploration of tax breaks and tax credits to help carers avoid poverty and remain in employment.
Sound policies which look at maximising independence and choice for the people being cared for and carers.
Clarity about the “social contract� for carers – what the state, employers, and others will provide and what individuals have to contribute.
New legislation that treats carers as partners in care.
You get treated better and have more rights in this country if you are a criminal in prison, they get pampered by this government and get much choice, our elderly get nothing, they are being left to rot, as rosamary says, this winter like all winters will be especially hard for our elderly, it is a disgrace that in countries where the conditions are far colder, places such as Norway or Sweden they loose very few elderly people to the cold conditions of winter,how come these countries can provide good services for their elderly population and we cant?
What is it about our society that thinks it is alright to allow sick and elderly people to rot on there own in horrible conditions, sometimes dieing and not being discovered for weeks on end,there are going to be lots of sad cases in Lambeth this winter, Lambeth being the worst council in britain, mind you, all the elected councellors voted to increase their expense accounts and also awarded themselves all brand new mullberry phones, thats what i like to see, our councellors getting their priorities right.
What will it take for the government to do something? how many more cases of abuse in carehomes, how many more cases of malnutrition in our NHS hospitals,where has all the empathy gone for people who are helpless, we have become a very sick nation, and sadly i do not think there is any medicine strong enough at the moment to heal our country, things for our elderly will be getting much worse, one day this country will pay for its neglect.
Clive, no it wasn’t me who said someone caused another person’s death. As you well know.
What was this about challenging lies?
Carers Uk have today announced how much money carers save the government – £87 billion. The government’s response was that they do fund carers – to the tune of under £200 million a year.
This would be funny if it wasn’t so much of a slap in the face to so many carers.
Let’s see the government – and the other political parties – talk their way out of this.
It was a question Charles, I just couldn’t remember which Carers UK fanatic said it, it’s such a bland place I have difficulty remembering which follower said what so your last line I’ll just ignore…..though it’s good you admitted it was said in the first place (-:
As usual, where you are concerned, Clive, there is no possibility of constructive debate.
This bickering is harming the cause of carers, so I will withdraw from this, with apologies to the site owner.
Will you do the same?
Tony R, have only just had time now to come back here and I know things have moved on, but I would like to come back to your petition. Personally I do think that handouts hurt, because the government gets away with giving a little sop to the few, without addressing the needs of the many. The general public then thinks that a good job is being done and we all slip back under the carpet until the next sop. What we want and what we need is a decent level of income for all the vulnerable in our society. The information is all out there, the government knows what needs to be done, but while we campaign for sops, they get away with ignoring the bigger picture.
The treatment of our elderly is indeed scandalous, as is the fact that the general public still has the impression that being a carer means popping in on someone and doing a bit of shopping.
The fact is, the money is there to do all the things that are neccesary, the political will is not.
So what your saying pansy is that in the meantime we should not bother to help people, we should just wait and watch all those people suffer without making an effort to change something, wait untill the government gives us what we deserve, if that is the case, should we just not bother with any charities whatsoever?, sadly some people in our society have to rely on the good work of some charitable institutions because otherwise they would not survive.
Your right, the government does have enough money there to pay carers and pensioners what they need, but untill they actually hand over that money i dont see any harm with trying to put pressure on people to try to change things.
Tony Rhodes
I think Pansy has a very vallied point hand outs do hurt, and a lot off people will not claim them, but also these handouts make it look as the government are doing something when they are not, what is really needed is less pressure being put on for handouts, and the pressure being applied to solve the whole problem for all the people not just a few.
Sorry Charles but as I said I prefer to say things as I see them.
That was said and I couldn’t remember who said it, can’t understand why you object to being called a Carers UK fanatic though?
As for the “bickering harming the cause of Carers” I beg to differ. It has focused Carers UK’s mind as to what Carers REALLY want/need/deserve and slowly they are having to come out of their comfort zone, THAT’S down to US. They have sat on their hands for years because people allowed them to because “they are a charity so they must be doing some good”
They have blocked Carers from taking part in government consultations because “they know best” and they DON’T. People have allowed them to help keep Carers in poverty, if Imelda Redmond had taken our “Live The Life If A Carer” challenge I might have shifted my view of her SLIGHTLY, but she didn’t.
Oh, example? Tony’s regarding charities, people are coming to realise that the money that charities receive doesn’t get spent on the ‘good causes’ they represent, it goes on wages in the main AND THAT’S WHY donations to charities are at an all time low. Charities are businesses that don’t have to prove they are being successful. Charities are now either tools of the government or money making schemes.
I know people don’t like me for my outspoken views and to be honest I don’t really care because I’m NOT going to sit on my backside and wait for change, I’ll get in the faces of as many people or politicians or media as possible to show we (Carers) aren’t feeble people that need others to speak for us, we are damn strong and have minds of our own (most are far smarter mentally than me before anyone thinks I’m referring to myself) Carers need a strong ‘front’ and they now have it and if it unsettles some people then tough, change is WELL overdue
Tony R.
I am NOT saying we should do nothing and just wait.
If you happen not to agree with someone on a quick glance, do you actually bother to read and understand what they said?
I said we should be all out for a for a proper standard of living for pensioners, carers, disabled etc. not asking for and being grateful for handouts.
I am not a charity case and I resent people who want to make me one.
“and the pressure being applied to solve the whole problem for all the people not just a few”
So a universal benefit/allowance for everyone regardless of their income or savings?
At the moment it seems that people who have been unable to save or have seen their income disappear are reduced to living below the poverty line, while people who have savings watch them rapidly disappear just to live.
When did growing old become such a crime in this country?
What happened to ‘each according to his needs’?
Yes Clive I see how that looks
“and the pressure being applied to solve the whole problem for all the people not just a few�
it is not exactly want I meant we need a full package that can benifit every one but peoples needs have to be assed properly
Which goes back to being means tested and forms having to be filled in and pensioners won’t do that because it’s seen as ‘demeaning’
I agree with you Clive, but I do not know how to get away from the means tested system, because if there is flat allowance for all then we are back to the rich get richer and the poor get poorer, this is an issue that needs to be debated and hope some one has some ideas that we can put forward.